Me: What is unique about this study is that for me, I realized that even if the progenitor stem-like cells in the epiphysis or resting zone get differentiated into chondrocytes, the chondrocytes don’t ever seem to stop differentiating and transforming until they reach the end of the hypertrophic zone (HZ). They reach the last stage of their life by turning into non dividing chondrocytes which get hypertrophic. In the resting zone, it seems that the chondrocytes and stem-like cells in there are being held back from differentiating and proliferating by BMP signaling inhibitors. This seems to imply for the first time that maybe, just maybe that over expression of BMPs, at least certain types of BMP, can not be helpful or even damaging towards longitudinal growth. If the BMP signals never show up, the stem-like progenitor cells seem to just like in stasis without any differentiation in the RZ. It sort of also suggest that there is only so much number of stem-likes cells to originally deal with and that the usefulness in manipulating BMPs to increase the number of proliferative cells may be limited. 

For the Resting Zone (RZ): 1. Overexpression of BMP-3 by 100X, 2. over expression of gremlin by 80X compared to the PZ

For the Proliferative Zone (PZ): 1. Over expression of GDF-10 by 160X compared to HZ

For the Hypertrophic Zone (HZ): 1. up regulation of BMP2 by 30X, 2. up regulation of BMP-6 by 30X compared to RZ & PZ.

The Main Point

• 1. Low levels of BMP signaling in the resting zone may help maintain these cells in a quiescent state.
• 2. BMP signaling gradients may be a key mechanism responsible for spatial regulation of chondrocyte proliferation and differentiation in growth plate cartilage

From PubMed study link HERE…

Gradients in bone morphogenetic protein-related gene expression across the growth plate.

Me: I got an email recently from Tyler to do a little research on a condition called Multiple Exotoses to see whether it might have any connection with possible height increase. Wikipedia is always the first link that appears. however, the term that is most cited is NOT multiple exoduses but “hereditary multiple exoduses”.

From this link here…

“Extosis – An exostosis is a bone growth that is abnormal or different from the underlying architecture of the bone. These “abnormal growths” are not cancer, They are benign. Sometimes doctors refer to exostoses as “tumors” which like exostose is a general term meaning abnormal growth.”

It seems that Hereditary Multiple Exotoses (aka HME or MHE) is where you get multiple bone spurs and lumps that appear on the bone.  However, for the Hereditary type, HME, this condition only affects children. Hence the hereditary part. From the wikipedia article on HME (HERE)…

“It is characterized by the growth of cartilage-capped benign bone tumours around areas of active bone growth, particularly the metaphysis of the long bones. HME can lead to the shortening and bowing of bones; affected individuals often have a short stature….A person with HME has an increased risk of developing a rare form of bone cancer called chondrosarcoma as an adult. Problems may be had in later life and these could include weak bones and nerve damage.”

It seems the condition can not be cured and that the two most common treatments are surgical methods to  remove the bone spurs/lumps but the osteosarcoma just reappears in the same place later on. The big thing seems to be that the spurs causes a lot of pain. The condition is autosomally dominant and hereditary with a 96% change of a person expressing it if they have the dominant gene. It will be transferred to the children of parent with it. It can also just come about spontaneously. Wikipedia says that “Since the HME genes are involved in the synthesis of a glycan (heparan sulfate), HME may be considered a congenital disorder of glycosylation”. We know that Heparan sulfate is a member of the glycosaminoglycan family of carbohydrates or a proteoglycan. The exact mechanism for how a mutation in the 3 genes associated with HME actually affects bone growth is not known yet. They are…

• EXT1 which maps to chromosome 8q24.1,  EXT2 which maps to 11p13,  EXT3 which maps to the short arm of Chromosome 19

From the genetics home reference website on the National Institute of Health website located HERE the thing they say about HME is that it only is expressed in children, and by the time the kid is 12, they most likely would have expressed the exoduses. However, when they turn into adults and they stop growing in size, i.e.. their growth plates have fused, the bone growths stop. The thing about multiple exoduses is that when a person gets the disorder, it doesn’t increase bone length but disrupts the growth process leading to short stature, stunting growth ,and limb curvature. The condition is usually non-cancerous. It seems to be a rather rare condition.

From WheelersOnline.com…

It is an osteochondroma that results from a dysplasia of peripheral growth plate. Dysplasia is a term used in pathology to refer to an abnormality of development. This generally consists of an expansion of immature cells, with a corresponding decrease in the number and location of mature cells. It also seems this disorder can be diagnosed rather early, usually around 3.  from the source…

“- cartilaginous exostoses arise from metaphyses, point away from epiphysis, and appear to extend down diaphysis during growth;”

Again it is stated that they increase in size & number w/ growth, but may become latent at maturity. The disorder really only affects people with their growth plates open, children. If the person has stopped increasing in height, they have become the very small minority of people where the exotoses has turned into Chondrosarcoma.

The link between this disorder and longitudinal growth seems to be from the study found below…

EXT1 regulates chondrocyte proliferation and differentiation during endochondral bone development.

Me: This topic was something I realized I would have to look into at some point since the link between cancer and height is very clear. I got a message from Tyler recently for me to look into it as well. First, what does wikipedia say about it (HERE)?

“Chondrosarcoma is a cancer composed of cells derived from transformed cells that produce cartilage. Chondrosarcoma is a member of a category of tumors of bone and soft tissue known as sarcomas. About 30% of skeletal system cancers are chondrosarcomas. While the disease can affect people (or animals) of any age, unlike most other forms of skeletal system cancer, it is more common among older people than among children, and more often affects the axial skeleton than the appendicular skeleton.”

“The most common sites for chondrosarcoma to grow are the pelvis and shoulder, along with the superior metaphysial and diaphysial regions of the arms and legs. However, chondrosarcoma may occur in any bone, and are sometimes found in the skull, particularly at its base.”

What I think is really critical to explain right now is that I have had a certain guess for a long time now after reading enough papers on the natural growth process that certain ways we might try as adults to gain height might also lead to increase rates and levels of getting cancer.

From the website for The Liddy Shriver Sarcoma Initiative…

What is chondrosarcoma?

Chondrosarcoma is a type of sarcoma that affects the bones and joints. It is a rare cancer that is diagnosed in 2,100 patients each year in the United States. Chondrosarcoma typically affects adults between the age of 20 and 60 years old, and it is more common in men. The disease usually starts in the bones of the arms, legs or pelvis, but it can be found in any part of the body that contains cartilage. Sometimes chondrosarcoma grows on an otherwise healthy bone, and sometimes it grows on a benign bone tumor (an enchondroma or osteochondroma).

There are several types of chondrosarcoma that are named based on the way that they appear under the microscope. These include:

• Conventional chondrosarcoma
• Clear cell chondrosarcoma
• Myxoid chondrosarcoma
• Mesenchymal chondrosarcoma
• Dedifferentiated chondrosarcoma

What causes chondrosarcoma?

As with many cancers, the cause of chondrosarcoma is not clear. However, people with certain medical conditions have an increased risk for developing chondrosarcoma. These conditions include:

• Ollier’s Disease
• Maffucci Syndrome
• Multiple Hereditary Exostoses (MHE, a.k.a., osteochondromatoses)
• Wilms’ Tumor
• Paget’s disease
• Diseases in children that required previous treatment with chemotherapy or radiation therapy

As for the genetics and causes of the cancer, it has been rather hard to find sources which can determine the cause of it, from the website…

The genetic changes specific to chondrosarcoma continue to be investigated extensively. Although studies have not yet established a specific or recurrent karyotypic feature for any of these tumors, different chondrosarcomas have demonstrated anomalies in several tumor suppressor genes, oncogenes, and transcription factors, including TP53, RAS, EXT1, EXT2, and Sox9. Available cytogenetic and comparative genomic hybridization (CGH) studies reveal changes in some chondrosarcomas, but fail to do so in others. These studies are thus far difficult to interpret.

Based on the available studies, it is likely that chondrosarcomas are generated by a coordinated, multi-step process involving primarily tumor suppressor genes. In fact, the complexity and variety of genetic changes seen in chondrosarcomas may indicate several distinct genetic pathways. Some of the same genes may be involved in each, but the order and manner in which they are affected may differ among chondrosarcomas.

Final Words: The topic of cancer is a very complex, and large field of study. I once wanted to become a hematologist/oncologist at one point in my educational career but I realized that the field of cancer is too large and difficult for one person to understand even at a reasonable level. When I was given the task of studying on chondrosarcoma I forgot just how intensive the research would be. For right now, my understanding of chondrosarcoma is very limited and I also realize that many websites on the internet has said that the exact genetics or pathway mechanism on how chondrosarcoma develops is not well understood. This website is to find  way to gain height. Right now I can’t see or connect how learning more about chondrosarcoma will help lead to possible height increase since not even the medical professionals have figured even one pathway mechanism yet. My approach has always been to look at the pathway a mechanism occurs and try to take the theory and find ways to apply it in everyday life. If in a few years the pathways for how cancer of the cartilage is understood better, maybe we can use the genetic pathways and propose that it might be abel to stimulate that pathway to lead to adult onset cartilage cell proliferation while keeping the growth rate below what would lead to malignant tumors.

[Update 3: So after careful consideration and thought I have decided not to activate the forum for this website. I have thought over the mistakes, problems, and issues that I have seen in previous discussion boards dealing with height increase and I think that if I allowed the forum to be activated, the discussion forum will inevitably end up in the same state. I can not dedicate that amount of time and energy to such a small section of the site. The sections will still be around but there will be a VERY CLEAR SIGN that says that the forum is NOT activated. Maybe some time long down the road when the website is more stable and has a larger community, and I can find good help, I’ll turn the forum on for use.]

[Update 2: I was just informed earlier today from a message on here and on the website email by my collaborator on this project Nicki that the GrowTaller forum/board was shut down. The cause has something to do with drama, politics, and it resulted in many account members being upset with the people who were running the place. Overall, it seems to suggest that the idea of having a forum/board may not be a very good idea. I have figured how to allow other people on the website to edit and post stuff now but I am hesitant to activate the feature since it would both change the graphical layout of the website and also lead to more message board human caused issues.]

[Update: I have decided to add the feature of a forum to this website. However since I am using the bbPress Plugin I seem to be the only person who can actually go in and edit things and post. It will take me a while before I can figure out how to turn that section into a real community discussion board and have other people stop by, login, and communicate with each other.]

So My application to join the GrowTaller forum or board was denied. I got a short and curt message in my inbox. I personally have never been ever denied in terms of application to ever join a board or forum before. This is a first for me.

I now know of maybe 7+ forums or boards on the internet that talks and deals with height increase (at least the ones in english, I would assume there are boards found in other languages). They are…

1. Impartial Height Increase Message Boards – Almost no activity on there anymore.

2. Giant Scientific – This website is still one of the most vast and intensive. The activity has dropped a lot since 2006.

3. GrowTallerForums.com – This seems to be where Hakker was a member

4. Make Me Taller – This website is focused mostly on using limb lengthening techniques and strategies to increase height.

5. GrowTaller – Where I got denied of an account.

6. LSJL forum – I posted 2 posts, one for the $10,000 challenge and another one which I don’t remember.

7. Maybe 3-4 other height increase forums and boards who used the old Forum54 platform, all of them also very dead of activity. I found out about these boards from the Short Support Website webpage link HERE.

So in my effort to join these boards, I have not really been successful. My application to get an account on Giant Scientific I either never got a message or I don’t remember that the email was sent but I do think (not sure since my memory is fuzzy on this one) I never posted anything on there. I don’t think I applied to get into Make Me Taller because the people on there are really xenophobic of outsiders and don’t want to believe that anything else besides limb lengthening is possible. They are not that accepting of alternative ideas. The Impartial Height Increase Message Board and the other boards on #7 have almost no activity so I never tried to join them. I think I tried to apply for a account on the GrowTallerForum but I never got a reply back on my application. There is a LSJL forum which I applied and got a membership in. That one was the only one that actually worked. And earlier today I get a message saying my account application for GrowTaller was denied. That makes it one application success out of 4. However this is the first time I ever got an email back stated blatantly that my application was rejected. Most forums and boards that have not accepted me before just never bothered to give a reply or message. I always just assumed that the admins and moderators chose never to hit the accept button or chose to ignore the email messages.

So this height increase forum or board is completely new to me and I didn’t even know it existed until my collaborator for the website told me that they and another frequent reader (and poster) of this website that they frequented this boards. Apparently this is where the person who goes by the username Alkoclar (spl?) is found and has been talking about a type of compound or “stuff” that can supposedly reverse the growth plate cartilage ossification process.

One thing I did learn and takeaway is that the GrowTaller Board is built on a platform called ProBoards. The link for the ProBoards website is right HERE. On the front page is a claim that says that using ProBoards I can create and build my own forum for FREE and that it takes less than 1 minute. I kind of sounds a attractive to me. However, I know and have been on many internet message boards and forums to know that sometimes these forums can build up and turn into place where there is A LOT OF DRAMA. People on them can private message (PM) the moderators and ask them to ban or suspend other people and stuff and drama just gets out of control. I am really hesitant about this idea first because the main panel on the website is already filled up with sections like “downloads” and “endocrinology”. I guess I could choose just to push the sections “orthopaedics” and “endocrinology” together under one main panel section header and leave the “gene database” by itself and create a section for a “forum” section to resolve the issue with website aesthetics. However, I also realize that moderating and dealing with a forum requires a lot of dedication, time, commitment, and stuff to do like forum maintenance, and operating resources.

If I get enough feedback from the other people/ readers of this website and the overall decision is a positive one, I’ll either try to get a forum to operate as a section of the main website or just put a link that is separate but with the same name in terms of association like “Natural Height Growth Boards” or something. However I would want at least a dozen responses from a dozen different regular website visitors for this post. I also don’t want to a start another internet forum only to have no one going to it and hearing the sound of crickets.

So my last question is “Should I create a forum for this website?”

Just check out the email I got from them below. I snipped it using the Mac OS6 hotkey Shift+Command+4.

Heel Lift Height Increase Silicone Shoe Insole 7 Pads

From from Ebay link HERE…

I remember seeing these height increase silicone shoe insoles on Ebay and I wanted to share it with the readers. From just an initial look at the insoles, I would say that this shoewear is a horrible product. The claim is that the stacked insole has 7 layers, which all combine together to give a person a 2.75 inch increase (or 7 cm). You also have the nice option of removing and adding the insoles depending on how high and tall you want the extra height.

Here is my problem with it. Obviously anyone who buys this product wants to look taller, and be discrete about it. They would want to be as much taller as possible so they would want to use all 7 layers. However, there are very few shoes in the world which has enough space to fit the entire 7 layers, which would probably take up 50% of all the space inside any shoe. If you put all 7 layers in, there is no room left for ones’s foot.

If you look at most sneakers, boots, or dress shoes, the level where the feet’s heel touch and were the surrounding material covers is only around 2-3 inches high. This insole would push the level of where the heel of the feet would go past even that surrounding material. There is not where the feet can go. In addition, even if you did buy larger sized shoes, with taller surrounding material, you can see that the insole is pushed up to a really slanted angle at almost a 45 angle. I don’t know any human feet that is structured to be able to fit comfortably in a shoe with this type of insole inside. The back heel bone (calcanus) would have to be grinded to half of it’s volume at a plane angle to get the feet to slide into the shoes. Of course then the hassle and difficulties would be too much for just a silicone insole.

So the 3 major problems are…

1. The 7 layer insole would take up so much room inside the shoes that the feet would not be able to go in or fit.

2. The 7 layer insole would be so high that it would be so close or even higher than the surrounding erect shoe material that one can not hold the feet in place without sliding out.

3. The 7 layer insole is designed so that it is at a steep angle. There is no human feet structured that can fit in a shoe with this type of insole inside since the back bone is protruding outwards and downwards.

To solve the three problems, one would have to obviously remove at least 4 of the insoles so that the feet can fit relatively comfortably and easily into the shoes. If that is the case, then why would anyone want to buy 7 layers in the first place when it would make the most practical sense to sell what would actually work, which is probably 3-4 layers.  

Me: I have just become aware very recently that there is at least one company where you might be able to order and get chondrogenesis raw materials which is Invitrogen. They seem to sell pretty much everything that I would want to get if I had a real laboratory to work with to test different types of growth factors to see how they would affect limb growth and limb fractures. There are stem cells, progenitors cells, osteocyte/chondrocyte differentiation mediums, and a lot of other stuff. The stuff is not allowed for personal use of course but in maybe a few years we could be able to get them for human use if we can prove in the lab in its efficacy.

Let’s see what some of the products you can find are…

For the StemPRO Chondrogenesis Differentiation Kit, you can click HERE to get to  product catalog PDF for the company Invitrogen. This also includes the STEMPRO® MSC SFM or MesenPRO RSTM Medium